need help with jelly fillings

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Permalink Reply by John DePaula on December 23, 2008 at 3:30pm

That's difficult... With the caveat that I haven't done this myself, you could try this: chill the backless filled bonbons and spray a thin layer of cocoa butter. This will "pre-seal" the chocolate so that you can then seal them in the normal way once the mold has returned to room-temperature.

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Permalink Reply by Frank Schmidt on December 23, 2008 at 3:41pm

Thanks John,
I tried this in a way upon recommendation by Gloria Rogers at Baker's Rack in Old Lenexa, Ks near Kansas City.

Problem: The jelly is not fluid such that it settles flat in the mold. ie, it is lumpy. Hence the cocoa butter pools in low places and is therefore thick enough that one can taste it. This interferes with both the mouth feel but more importantly the flavor carrythrough of the jelly which has specific varietal wine flavor notes. Hum.....

Still searching. There will be an answer, I've just not found it yet.
Thanks again for your input.

Frank

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Permalink Reply by John DePaula on December 23, 2008 at 4:58pm

This is why I recommended that the tray be well chilled before spraying the cocoa butter - it will instantly harden when it hits the filling - so no pooling or sinking. However, if the filling is too high, then you'll be out of luck.

With fillings that are too stiff, you can sometimes lay plastic film across the top of the mold and gently flatten each bonbon; afterwards, you can gently peel back the film for sealing.

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Permalink Reply by jean-francois Bonnet on December 24, 2008 at 1:28pm

OK a per Clay's request I'll try to help...first NEVER try to accelerate the process by chilling your molds, all you'll do is, make it colder! you filling needs to "crust in order for the chocolate to stick to it without creating condensation. how liquid is your filling? if it is very thin the only way is to make your shell thicker. if it is semi-liquid then, make sure that you recipe contains glucose in order to create a "crust", allow your filling to fully set also (overnight is always good).
you should not encounter a problem this way.
don't hesitate to reply if you have more questions or problems.
Merry Christmas
JF

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Permalink Reply by Frank Schmidt on December 24, 2008 at 4:59pm

Thank you guys for such quick and thoughtful feed back on my jelly problems. It is wonderful to have found this Chocolate Life site where there is such serious interest and helpfulness ; this is a rather knotty and perplexing issue for me.

You see, I’m not just asking how to make a solid jell or crusted filling inside a chocolate confection. My perspective is that of a commercial grape grower and hobbyist winemaker. The issue really is wine flavor carry- through. The flavor notes of the grape variety in question will get locked up in a solid jell. The jelly, if “set”, I mean well set, will not release those flavors that identify the wine to my customer, the winemaker who bought my grapes; it is his wine after all which I wish him to taste and recognize in the chocolate piece. The chocolate is a container.

Now that you perhaps have a better understanding of my objectives, I’ll respond to the questions posed. As to the thickness of my jelly: it is not a runny soup. It certainly is lumpy. If set so hard that it could be picked up off a plate with a fork then the object of my effort is lost as per above reasons. Jells like those that are of fruit puree and encrusted with sugar just will not do.

Yes, Jean-Francois, my jelly does have glucose and I have worked with several recipes of sugar concentration in combination with pectin to minimize the amount of sugar so as not to alter the wine flavor notes excessively. Lowering sugar prevents set altogether.

Creating a “crust” and allowing the jelly to fully set (if that means set hard) may not get me closer to the flavor preservation I am after. But I will continue to experiment with recipes.

The seal is the deal. I’m trying to have a semi-liquid jelly ; not so runny that a customer squirts wine on his shirt when biting into the chocolate but liquid enough that it does taste like a specific wine when eaten. To seal that in without leakage is the issue. Will it stay sealed, even then? Will the jelly dissolve the chocolate in time? That is yet to be determined. I’m trying to solve the first problem first.

“without creating condensation” I don’t know to what this refers. Is condensation a result of chilling the mold or is it a problem of some other sort? It looks as though this sentence suggests that an objective is for the chocolate to stick to the filling but I am not sure why this would be a goal. At least not in my case.

Tonight I’ll start conching a new batch of Papua New Guinea beans which I roasted last evening and then begin again with molding and filling. Will report if I find success with the jelly seal.

Thanks again,
And Merry Christmas to you all
Frank

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Permalink Reply by Robert Shea on December 28, 2008 at 6:08am

First, I applaud you... so few chocolatiers make an effort to maintain true flavors of the filling. The number of filled chocolates where I couldn't even tell what the flavor was aside from some chemical concoction... *shudder*

You can use a sprinkle of gelatin and then later a sprinkle of papain or actinidin right before sealing and this would solve one problem (sealing the chocolate) but might leave you with others (they'll prolly weep, the condensation others spoke of, where water migrates from the filling, through the shell and beads on the outside of the chocolate).

First, Mr. Bonnet is incorrect regarding glucose as it reduces and eventually halts crystallization with increasing quantity, thus it, in no way helps the formation of the crust, in fact it does the exact opposite.

As for your pectin not setting with lower sugar concentrations, try using a low methoxyl pectin. You could make a wine pate with just the wine, pectin (0.5-3% depending on what you're looking for, more for thicker), a little calcium gluconolactate (~1-2%), and a little sodium citrate (~0.8% for red wine, which is what I assume you're using). You may want to add some glucose or better yet sorbitol to reduce water activity.

Cheers,

Rob

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Permalink Reply by jean-francois Bonnet on December 29, 2008 at 11:06am

it is a little difficult to really understand what type of filling you are talking about but just to clarify...i know that glucose avoids crystals; what i meant was to let the filling dry longer to have a skin (if you prefer that term from a crust).

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Permalink Reply by Robert Shea on December 29, 2008 at 5:34pm

The first was a temporary gelatin skin and the second is a pectin gel. The calcium is used to set the pectin and the sodium citrate (typo: should be ~0.008%) balances the pH as too low a pH will prevent the pectin from setting.

I was unclear why you mentioned to make sure glucose is in there in order to form a crust, just figured it best to clarify.

Cheers,

Rob

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Permalink Reply by Frank Schmidt on December 31, 2008 at 6:41pm

Rob,
I continue working on this conundrum. The sprinkling of gelatin has helped a lot!

Already I've been able to thin the molded shells and thus increase the jelly, or fruit piece which has been brandied so that the size of interior flavor is huge. I need to know more about the concentrations of components which you discuss. Please e_mail me if you wish to discuss this: fhsdds@tri-lakes.net . I'd like to pursue it.

Thanks
Frank (Mr. WineCandy)

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